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Jun 24th 2017, 01:17 PM   #31
 Jstilt's Avatar
 
  May 2016
  Olympia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
That's all fine and good but at the same time there are other people on the road with you. IF you have a problem then it has a negative impact on everyone else. Riding on the shoulder, lane splitting, filtering, etc. while it's illegal, also casts all of us in a negative light.

I'm not against the law changing to allow it due to safety issues, but until then we need to follow the existing law.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
Yup, I'm serious and human nature backs it up. If you have people of a specific group that break the law, it reflects negatively on the rest of the group that abide by the law.

Don't like the law saying that lane splitting is illegal? Violating it is a great way to loose the argument that it should be legal. Instead, follow the law and work to educate your family, friends and neighbors about it plus write to your reps and explain why they should support the legalization of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
I disagree with the law and advocate following the law WHILE working to change it. It doesn't matter if breaking it doesn't cause undue physical or financial harm. Think if the terms of a witness in court. Will the jury put more weight behind what a repeat offender says or what a law abiding person says?

The efforts to persuade legislators to change the law is essentially a trial. On one side you have the WSP saying one thing. They are seen as the law abiding people because they are charged with enforcing the law. On the other you have a group of people, some of whom willingly violate laws, saying the opposite. They will put more weight behind what the WSP says. That won't change until we get enough weight behind us. Increasing the number of endorsed riders is one way. Another is getting enough support from the general population, which is harder if they see people breaking the law we are trying to get changed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
I'm glad you get what I'm saying. I just don't buy the argument that others breaking the law means that we should. It leads to a slippery slope into anarchy on the roads.

As riders, we should be more mature, responsible and reasonable than that.
Wow, chrishil54, i am sorry to throw your theory's under the bus, i mean you are by all means to entitled to your own opinion but....

What about all the idiot drivers that don't pay attention, are on there cell phones, that do anything else in there car except drive? what about all those people giving other drivers bad names? just like your concern of us "non lawn abiding riders" giving you and the rest of the motor cycle world a bad name? you are kinda coming across like you are a gods saint child that has never done anything wrong, and people hate those dudes. if i had posted that I was blowing through traffic, lane splitting at above speed limit speeds, then by all means, call me out. but what I, and many other riders are doing is taking are lives into are own hands, and being responsible about it. I have been riding a bike since I was old enough to get my leg over it, and now I am an adult, a father, a husband, a respected part of the motor cycle community. I am not some ass hat on a ninja 250 wearing shorts and sandals doing stand up wheelies down the highway. I have respect for the laws, I am aware of the consequences of breaking them, but the consequences of not breaking them sometimes out weigh the choice to obey, and that is serious injury or death, one choice i choose for myself!

As far as talking to my local Representative, it does no good, its all about money these days. so until the the motorcycle community starts throwing money at one or a few representatives, then i'm sorry but the efforts of a few fall on death ears. its all lies to get into office, and once there they only see fit to do what benefits the people and organizations with money.

Do you think it is fair, that I should have to pay, and bribe, and all the other stupid ways this world works now, to be able to protect my own life?

the only thing I am doing by breaking the law is frustrating other drivers, they feel offended, they feel cheated, so what! they have the right to go buy a motorcycle and do what i am doing, know one is stopping them. if they feel what i am doing is unsafe, fine. they can have that opinion, be mad, think that I am idiot, its ok. i will go about my day, as will they, and life will go on.

I am not really sure what the reference to the sheep's and goats means? maybe because I'm not religious. but really it sounds a lot like Jesus playing the roll of the representatives, the people that helped him being played by all the money people and the motorcycle community being the people that said F! you, you do nothing for us so go to hell!?!?!
Jun 24th 2017, 01:45 PM   #32
 WarpShatner7's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Here

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
Another is getting enough support from the general population, which is harder if they see people breaking the law we are trying to get changed.
You just mention this in passing but this is my main reason for not lanesplitting. It's pretty normal for people to get pissed off at scofflaws, it doesn't matter if they're not being hurt by it. Once they've been pissed off they're going to be a tough sell in the voting booth.
VeritasImageryNW likes this.
Jun 25th 2017, 10:06 AM   #33
 Texasl's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Northeast Olalla

  07 Guzzi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jstilt
As far as talking to my local Representative, it does no good, its all about money these days. so until the the motorcycle community starts throwing money at one or a few representatives, then i'm sorry but the efforts of a few fall on death ears. its all lies to get into office, and once there they only see fit to do what benefits the people and organizations with money.

Do you think it is fair, that I should have to pay, and bribe, and all the other stupid ways this world works now, to be able to protect my own life?
I'm going to have to vehemently disagree with you on this. While there are some elected who will answer to the money stream, but it is not the majority. I am more than a bit of a subject matter expert in this area, having been an active representative of one motorcyclist organization or another for over two decades.

The crucial piece of the communications puzzle is to develop a long term relationship with your elected, not just have one or two conversations a year during the hustle and bustle of a legislative session. If you are not on a first name basis with your elected representatives then you have not done your job.

What will not work is the sort of negative vitriol that seems to substitute for engagement when people have disagreements over policy issues. Respectful conversations to engender trust and educate people go much further than attacks on motives and integrity.

Everyone who is frustrated with the system needs to invest more mental and sweat equity in it.
Jun 26th 2017, 04:08 AM   #34
 
  May 2016
  Vancouver, WA

I think the best question here is: What's the penalty for lane splitting? If you're willing to pay that, then do it. Nuff sed.
Jun 26th 2017, 07:01 AM   #35
 Bald Guy's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kennewick

  KTM SAR Husqvarna Strada, Ural Patrol and a shit load of BN125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bardo
I think the best question here is: What's the penalty for lane splitting? If you're willing to pay that, then do it. Nuff sed.
According to this website, http://www.courts.wa.gov/newsinfo/co...l_Schedule.pdf, the base fine is $136.00. The local court the case is tried in can add local court costs and other fees that will substantially increase that amount.

Edited by Bald Guy on Jun 26th 2017 at 07:05 AM
Jun 26th 2017, 09:15 AM   #36
 Sentinel's Avatar
 
  Jun 2016
  Poor Tortured

  2015 Kawasaki Concours 14 - The Origame Sea-Dragon
fines are for suckers who get caught.

Jun 26th 2017, 04:30 PM   #37
 albatrosscafe's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Issaquah

  2015 Yamaha FZ-07
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bardo
I think the best question here is: What's the penalty for lane splitting? If you're willing to pay that, then do it. Nuff sed.
I got caught January of last year or so in Bellevue, WA.

Fee was $136 for violation of RCW 46.61.608.3, "Motorcycle between lanes/vehicles". I was going through stopped traffic at a red light so who knows if the officer would have found something more severe if everyone was moving.
Jun 27th 2017, 12:47 AM   #38
 
  Jun 2017
  Kent

I didn't think I'd ever do it
But found myself doing it
It was like the first time having sex
You're a little nervious
And you're thinking about everything bad that can happen
After the first mile you're like wow that's kinda cool
Second or third mile it almost feels like that paranoid weed is kicking in.
And you start telling yourself "man I'm gonna get busted "
So you stop for a little bit.
But then quickly find yourself doing it again.

And when you split a lane next to a police officer after doing it for about , well let's just I turned a 2 hour and 10 min commute into an hour tops
And he gives you that look !!!!
Cause suddenly he just realized what you were doing and has this WTF look on his face
But doesn't pull you over
Just gives you the LOOK
You make it to work
Nobody was harmed
And you look back at it like
That was alright
I like that
Jun 28th 2017, 04:10 PM   #39
 wooden's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  PDX

  '14 St3R, '05 DR650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
Another is getting enough support from the general population, which is harder if they see people breaking the law we are trying to get changed.
While I see your point in general, I don't believe for one second that the average Joe is going to believe you when you tell them lane splitting is safe unless they've seen someone do it safely. If it's illegal and no one does it, then they'll never see someone do it safely, and they'll never believe it's safe.

That's how I look at it, at least.
Jun 28th 2017, 05:47 PM   #40
 VeritasImageryNW's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Allyn, WA

  '06 HD Street Bob, '85 Yamaha FJ600, '99 Honda CBR600f4
Quote:
Originally Posted by wooden
While I see your point in general, I don't believe for one second that the average Joe is going to believe you when you tell them lane splitting is safe unless they've seen someone do it safely. If it's illegal and no one does it, then they'll never see someone do it safely, and they'll never believe it's safe.

That's how I look at it, at least.
Problem is that it is illegal, and obvious at that, so that makes riders that do it just appear criminal, not safe (no matter how slow you do it). Besides, we have to deal with the "fairness" aspect up here. I mean geez, just look at the fights that occur in merge zones with no one willing to give an inch, and then cars doing the shoulder routine to get around someone who has decided to enforce the merge themselves. And then just spend some time reading the comments of any article that deals with, or happens to talk about, lane splitting and/or filtering. It seems like the majority of cage drivers are entitled brats who don't think anyone should get to do something they can't, for any reason.

The reality is that until we can get WA voters and legislators to see motorcycles as viable means of travel, rather than just a risky hobby, we are fighting an uphill battle. A battle made worse by those few riders that decide to be stupid on the street, where everyone gets to see them do it.

To be honest, the moment you put that helmet on and climb onto that motorcycle you become an ambassador of the entire riding community. And what you do will have either a positive or a negative impact on that representation.
Texasl and FeralRdr like this.

Edited by VeritasImageryNW on Jun 28th 2017 at 05:51 PM
Jun 28th 2017, 06:18 PM   #41
 
  Aug 2016
  Snohomish county WA

  2002 FZ1 , 1979 gs425 project
I am all for doing it but the drivers here are not looking for it because its not legal. That's what scares me about it.
I rode in Cali for a year when I lived there and did a lot of lane splitting. Its safer to me because they are used to it. Here even if it became legal there will be a lot of asshat drivers that will do stupid shit to stop it. You will be hearing about it on the news every night about another motorcycle crash.
Jun 28th 2017, 06:51 PM   #42
 WarpShatner7's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Here

In places like Europe where you can be cited for not filtering, I assume they make an exception if your bike has huge metal Touratech panniers with sharp corners. Saw a Stelvio the other day that was wider than a Smart car.
Jun 28th 2017, 09:59 PM   #43
 Willow's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Silverdale, WA

  848evo, DRZ400SM, XR100
Got to agree with Wooden here. I posted this before in another lane splitting thread.....

Quote:
I was traveling to Long Island (NY), with my wife's family. We were in grid lock traffic on Hwy 95 to Hwy 295 over Throgs Neck Bridge and on down to Southern State Pkwy. As we sat in stop and go or VERY slow traffic, the whole way, there was one motorcycle after another lane splitting. Cars actually moved over for them. I was like....W-H-A-T???? I asked my sister-in-law, is it legal down here? She was like, nonchalant, "Oh NO.... it's illegal, but everyone does it anyway."
IMHO, legalizing MJ was pretty much the same way. Got to a point everybody was using it and growing it. Saw a program on TV a year to two before it became legalized and the authorities just were turning a blind eye to home growers that were popping up all over Seattle. It just became such a common place.
Jun 29th 2017, 08:02 AM   #44
 Texasl's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Northeast Olalla

  07 Guzzi
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeritasImageryNW
The reality is that until we can get WA voters and legislators to see motorcycles as viable means of travel, rather than just a risky hobby, we are fighting an uphill battle. A battle made worse by those few riders that decide to be stupid on the street, where everyone gets to see them do it.

To be honest, the moment you put that helmet on and climb onto that motorcycle you become an ambassador of the entire riding community. And what you do will have either a positive or a negative impact on that representation.
And this, Gumdrops, is what I have to deal with each and every legislative session. Legislators and their constituents do not remember the numerous competent and courteous riders that they encounter every day, but let them get surprised or frightened by somebody blasting past them, or let them be held up in a traffic jam while some juvenile idiots decide to do their bomb squad stuff, etc., and they will remember that forever.
Jun 30th 2017, 03:46 PM   #45
 VeritasImageryNW's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Allyn, WA

  '06 HD Street Bob, '85 Yamaha FJ600, '99 Honda CBR600f4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow
Got to agree with Wooden here. I posted this before in another lane splitting thread.....



IMHO, legalizing MJ was pretty much the same way. Got to a point everybody was using it and growing it. Saw a program on TV a year to two before it became legalized and the authorities just were turning a blind eye to home growers that were popping up all over Seattle. It just became such a common place.
Unfortunately that's not how traffic laws usually work. Just look at cell phone laws. People are still breaking that law, but instead of making it legal again, they are making the laws stricter and penalties more intense. The same happens if too much speeding occurs on a certain street in the city. Instead of saying "wow, a lot of people are ignoring this law, let's raise the speed limit", they do the exact opposite by either increasing enforcement, lowering the speed limit, or both.

The problem is that motorcyclists have to stop looking at this like motorcyclists, and start looking at it the way most car drivers do. And to do that you need to spend some time listening to them, or better yet, read the comments section whenever a news source talks about it.

Here's another aspect that some may not take into account with this particular thread. Mass transit is the pet project of the majority of our Democratic government officials. They want more people to use it and will do whatever it takes to make it look more appealing. On the other hand, motorcycles are a symbol of personal freedom and are kinda a middle finger to mass transit, therefore they become the "enemy" to the "feel good", social conscience driven government officials. So, any time a motorcyclist makes the news by being stupid, or killing themselves on the highway, those officials have yet another bullet to use to kill laws benefiting bikers.
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