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Nov 13th 2017, 05:45 AM   #1
 galenernest's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Beijing

  Honda CBF190R
Why remove the starter motor from a racer?

Why remove the starter motor? I'm assuming that the main reason is to shave a pound or two off the weight of a bike, but are there any other reasons?

I ask because I recently did a track day here in China, and most of the bikes I ran with didn't have a starter motor; they were all pretty much hacked up variations of the CB150. I ran my stock CBF190R.

I had the advantage in that I a) didn't crash and b) if I did crash, I wouldn't need to push my bike back to the pits to get it restarted. And for as slow as these riders were, they seemed to crash a lot...

My gut feeling is that they wanted their bikes to seem more like motoGP bikes... and I just think there are many other things that can be done to achieve lower lap times before removing the starter...

I have video... I may make a youtube thing later about track days in China if anyone is interested.
Nov 13th 2017, 05:56 AM   #2
 galenernest's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Beijing

  Honda CBF190R
Haoting track day - PNW Moto

Trying to post the photo... click above to see the bikes I'm talking about
Nov 13th 2017, 07:58 AM   #3
 ChopperDr's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Buckley

  BMW R1100S '98 HD FXD 08 CBR600RR-track
Not fuel injected? Drop the starter and the battery? Less weight goes faster!

Chop
Nov 13th 2017, 08:42 AM   #4
bcj
 bcj's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  teh rock

  K1200RS SV650
Doesn't the CB150 come with a kick start, or do they take that off too?
Seems small enough to not buy the extra electrical options for cheapness.
Nov 13th 2017, 09:11 AM   #5
 mgfchapin's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kirkland, WA

  '15 675R
Yeah, just weight. I've even toyed with the idea of removing the starter from my 675. It does present challenges if I were to stall at a start, or if I needed to turn the bike off waiting in hot pit for a crash to clear or something.

How did they start their bikes? Push-start or did they have a fancy GP-style start-cart?
Nov 13th 2017, 09:16 AM   #6
 Tripledij's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Custer WA

  Aprilia Tuono 1100
Just take a dump before your race and enjoy electric start. Lots of mx bikes with electric start these days.
Nov 13th 2017, 10:46 AM   #7
 holypiston's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Vancouver, WA

The only reason I could see is going back to the old GP style of push-starting from a standstill. That would be pretty cool.

Other than that....duh TWO STROKE!!!
Nov 13th 2017, 12:24 PM   #8
 MikeMikeMike's Avatar
 
  Feb 2016
  Seattle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripledij
Just take a dump before your race and enjoy electric start. Lots of mx bikes with electric start these days.
But you could take a dump and remove the starter/battery and be even lighter...

My track bike has a lithium ion battery that is just barely enough to get it started from cold, I'm also running a paired down stator/magnet set. Probably frees up 1-2hp and 5-6lbs. Still slower than everybody but by a little less.
Nov 23rd 2017, 11:09 AM   #9
 unicykle's Avatar
 
  Sep 2017
  milwaukie oregon

  rc51 Aprilia rsv
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcj
Doesn't the CB150 come with a kick start, or do they take that off too?
Seems small enough to not buy the extra electrical options for cheapness.
I would love to watch somebody try and kick start a hot litrebike
Nov 23rd 2017, 11:15 AM   #10
 GPD323's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Spanaway

Friends SR500 with a lot of mods is impossible to kick start. He uses a small cart with a 12 volt battery and a motor and rod that inserts into the side case to start it. Last race of the season he stalled it on the grid, that was the end of his race before it started.
Nov 24th 2017, 03:23 AM   #11
 galenernest's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Beijing

  Honda CBF190R
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgfchapin
Yeah, just weight. I've even toyed with the idea of removing the starter from my 675. It does present challenges if I were to stall at a start, or if I needed to turn the bike off waiting in hot pit for a crash to clear or something.

How did they start their bikes? Push-start or did they have a fancy GP-style start-cart?
They used a gas powered start cart in the pits, and when the bikes were warm, they could start them just by spinning the rear tire with their arms while the bike was on a stand.

But, throughout the day, there were at least five times that a rider crashed and couldn't bump start on the track... so lots of pushing bikes back to the pits.

My thinking is that the benefit of an electric start at this level of riding far outweighs the weight-savings of no starter motor. Everyone can benefit from more track time (and less time pushing bikes).
Nov 24th 2017, 06:46 PM   #12
 Parilla125's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  SeaTac

I would guess that just ONE bad entry or exit on a corner would equal any weight savings. Maybe they all sold them to get extra track money?
Nov 25th 2017, 07:31 AM   #13
 Wrench's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  West Richland, WA

A lot of engines have an idler gear or series of gears that interconnects the starter gear/one-way-bearing to the crank. Often, this gear or series of gears turns all the time with the crank, as the one-way-bearing is usually on or close to the starter. Taking this all out can often free up rotating mass, like lightening the flywheel.

Even with a kickstart, there is often an idler gear. They used to sell a kit for the NSR250 street bikes to block off the kickstart hole and removed all those parts, for better acceleration.

On smaller bikes that are easier to bumpstart and acceleration is at an extreme deficit, it may be worth it for that little bit of extra acceleration.
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