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Nov 3rd 2019, 10:56 AM   #16
 Sentinel's Avatar
 
  Jun 2016
  Poor Tortured

  2019 Nada
A VR environment would be a good trainer/tester for motorcycle skills.

I ran a VR "trainer" at the submarine base for a few years.

We'd get sailors in there and make them fight the russkies.

they'd fuck it up constantly. but after a few weeks they would actually get better. we could watch them improve.

and that improvement actually made it into the real world. we positively-correlated trainer skills with IRL inspection (Tactical Readiness Evaluation) scores.

There is a limit to the VR merit. It only goes so far. But there is a real, quantifiable benefit, especially for inexperienced operators.

I am NOT saying Call of Duty prepares you for Afghanistan. I am saying Flight Simulator prepares you for landing at Seatac.

Here is an opportunity for someone to get rich and to actually help riders. A company that would host a VR motorcycle trainer and that could be certified to test riders should be able to score a state contract for rider education and testing, and make a fortune.

AND if done right it could also be fun to go and do. Different bikes, different roads, different weather, advanced and "fun" training opportunities....I'd go do that.

AND there's already a lot of good software out there with realistic dynamics (roads, bikes, physics, all of that exists in a mature game environment that would only have to be gently redirected toward more IRL scenarios to serve as a rider trainer).

Edited by Sentinel on Nov 3rd 2019 at 11:02 AM
Nov 4th 2019, 01:03 PM   #17
 
  Jun 2016
  Portland area

Brillant idea, I think they exist. How to register for a class, I'm not sure. I'm imagining following famous racers on the Isle of Man course.

High school simulator:

Sent via SM-G930V
Nov 5th 2019, 07:51 AM   #18
 Bald Guy's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kennewick

  Versys 1000 SE LT+, Ural Patrol and a shit load of BN125
The kid wearing the yellow hat is getting into it!

Edited by Bald Guy on Nov 5th 2019 at 03:22 PM
Nov 5th 2019, 08:27 AM   #19
 unicykle's Avatar
 
  Sep 2017
  milwaukie oregon

  gsxr600 gsxr750 gsxr1000 i like gsxrs
I laugh my ass off at this target zero nonsense, just idealistic morons that are out of touch with reality, if you want no seroius crashes or traffics fatality's they are going to have to outlaw vehicles and make people walk and use helmets and still target zero isnt possible. If “20 is plenty” your to incompetent to drive in the first place.

Edited by unicykle on Nov 5th 2019 at 10:54 AM
Nov 5th 2019, 08:51 AM   #20
 VeritasImageryNW's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Allyn, WA

  '06 HD Street Bob, '85 Yamaha FJ600, '99 Honda CBR600f4
Quote:
Originally Posted by unicykle
...they are going to have to outlaw vehicles and make people walk...
That is the intent. Elimination of personal transportation is the end goal. A more reliant population is a more compliant population.
tod701 and Oregon Motorcycle like this.
Nov 5th 2019, 11:01 AM   #21
 unicykle's Avatar
 
  Sep 2017
  milwaukie oregon

  gsxr600 gsxr750 gsxr1000 i like gsxrs
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeritasImageryNW
That is the intent. Elimination of personal transportation is the end goal. A more reliant population is a more compliant population.
Thats a short sighted view of people who dont think things thru. You like the house you live in? Cause you arnt going to live in one by walking the materials it requires to build them, hows your food going to get to the store? Are
we all going to find jobs that pay the bills within walking distance? When you call 911 in an emergency its going to be a while if they are walking, and on and on
Nov 5th 2019, 12:26 PM   #22
 VeritasImageryNW's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Allyn, WA

  '06 HD Street Bob, '85 Yamaha FJ600, '99 Honda CBR600f4
Quote:
Originally Posted by unicykle
Thats a short sighted view of people who dont think things thru. You like the house you live in? Cause you arnt going to live in one by walking the materials it requires to build them, hows your food going to get to the store? Are
we all going to find jobs that pay the bills within walking distance? When you call 911 in an emergency its going to be a while if they are walking, and on and on
The intent is to make it more difficult to live in rural areas. Move everyone into controlled city environments. Once there, the people become less independent and more dependent on public services. Once dependent on public services it becomes more easy to manipulate them. Target Zero's ultimate goal is the reduction of the independent civilian. Personal transportation, the ability to go where and when I want, is the epitome of personal freedom. Personal freedom is directly the opposite of collectivism. And collectivism is the "preferred" example of "utopia".
tod701 likes this.
Nov 5th 2019, 10:15 PM   #23
 Parilla125's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  SeaTac

And the people in the city area’s have a different view than the rural area’s but have more voting power. As was stated once about Washington State voting, “You can get up on top of the Space Needle and see all the votes you need.”
Nov 6th 2019, 10:20 AM   #24
 mjh937's Avatar
 
  Feb 2016
  Bellingham, WA

  Yamaha FZ-07
Zero fatalities? There may be more support of the plan if it had a realistic goal. Even if every car was self driving you are still going to have the kid who runs in front of a car chasing a ball and gets killed, as an example. Even perfect reflexes cannot change physics.

I would rather they spent the resources getting drivers off their cell phones. I see people texting and driving every day and frequently pass the rear end collisions that ensue.

Finally I would love to take an advanced course to hone my skills but there are none offered in Whatcom or Skagit counties. I keep looking but so far have not found anything available north of Seattle.
Nov 6th 2019, 12:55 PM   #25
 VeritasImageryNW's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Allyn, WA

  '06 HD Street Bob, '85 Yamaha FJ600, '99 Honda CBR600f4
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjh937
Zero fatalities? There may be more support of the plan if it had a realistic goal.
There's plenty of support because it "sounds" good. The problem is that the whole "zero fatalities" isn't the actual goal, that's the claimed one that makes "sense" and touches emotions. Think about the parable of "boiling the frog".
Nov 6th 2019, 02:17 PM   #26
 unicykle's Avatar
 
  Sep 2017
  milwaukie oregon

  gsxr600 gsxr750 gsxr1000 i like gsxrs
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjh937

I would rather they spent the resources getting drivers off their cell phones. I see people texting and driving every day and frequently pass the rear end collisions that ensue.

Finally I would love to take an advanced course to hone my skills but there are none offered in Whatcom or Skagit counties. I keep looking but so far have not found anything available north of Seattle.

I would rather they fixed the fucking roads and timed the stop lights propperly. Any course run by the state isnt going to teach you a thing, do a suberbike school or buy a dirtbike and slide it around and dump it a bunch.
Nov 6th 2019, 02:20 PM   #27
 
  Mar 2018
  Gig Harbor

  2008 BMW R1200GS Adventure
Moving here from two states that already require riders to complete a rider safety course, I can tell you I see a lot of riders that NEED this.

Hell, if they just made sure riders understood what side of the lane to ride in and why, that would be an improvement. Or how to ride in a stagger... So tired of leaving the ferry with a bunch of random riders all going the same way with the stagger going Left, Right, right, right, left, left, center, sidewalk...
Nov 6th 2019, 03:00 PM   #28
 PeteN95's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Muklilteo, WA

  Suzuki DL1000, Honda XR650R, KTM 250 XC-W
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oregon Motorcycle
We need more education and training for people who drive cars. Very rare to see someone riding an MC who is not aware of their surroundings (weather, road conditions, traffic, etc). I see very bad driving habits several times a day and these are from people driving cars.
No argument about bad drivers, but over 1/3 of all motorcycle accidents are single vehicle, nearly double that of cars. I think this indicates some lack of skills. I think we should consider tiered licensing, like they use in Europe. I also think initial training should be on dirt. On the other hand, population control.
Nov 6th 2019, 07:03 PM   #29
 Bald Guy's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kennewick

  Versys 1000 SE LT+, Ural Patrol and a shit load of BN125
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteN95
No argument about bad drivers, but over 1/3 of all motorcycle accidents are single vehicle, nearly double that of cars. I think this indicates some lack of skills. I think we should consider tiered licensing, like they use in Europe. I also think initial training should be on dirt. On the other hand, population control.
The stats for fatal crashes in Washington are much more dire. Around 50% (usually a bit higher) are single vehicle crashes.

Another 20-30% are where the motorcyclist violates the automobile operator's right of way.

The rest is where the automobile operator violates the motorcyclists' right of way.

The percentages move up and down a bit each year, but single vehicle crashes always dominate. I do believe the stats are similar in Oregon and Idaho.

Seems to me we are overestimating our abilities and are riding to what we perceive our abilities to be rather than accepting we are of average abilities and riding accordingly.
Nov 6th 2019, 07:09 PM   #30
 unicykle's Avatar
 
  Sep 2017
  milwaukie oregon

  gsxr600 gsxr750 gsxr1000 i like gsxrs
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteN95
No argument about bad drivers, but over 1/3 of all motorcycle accidents are single vehicle, nearly double that of cars. I think this indicates some lack of skills. I think we should consider tiered licensing, like they use in Europe. I also think initial training should be on dirt. On the other hand, population control.
Alot of motorcycle accidents are single vehicle mostly beacause modern litre bikes are above all but about 1% of riders ability, track riders included, just think if all these moron drivers were driving supercars. All track day riders have seen the guy on the brand new r1 who could barly ride a pedal bike. That said the dmv testing at least in Oregon has no real world skills and is biast againt sport bikes imo.
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