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May 14th 2018, 05:11 PM   #1
 paradox206's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Des Moines

  M1200S, VFR800, XR650R & GSXR750
Lower Queen Anne Death Zone

I work right across the street from here and I can't believe the city hasn't blocked left turns here yet. And I know I shouldn't be shocked, but the slow or uncaring response from the cagers that caused the accidents are sickening.

From Friday:

From Today:

Today's Kia driver REALLY pisses me off, as he just steps out of his car, looks at the damage to his car, looks at the rider for a second and then gets back in his car. I know there were things the riders could have done to avoid these crashes, but GRRRRRR!!!

I'm so glad my company is moving...
Thumperpilot, Didley and Andonon like this.
May 14th 2018, 05:55 PM   #2
 Pavement Tested's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Bremerton

  '12 Concours14, '08 GSX1300R, '06 GSX-R 750
Video 1, motorcyclist appears to have been going too fast, especially given the traffic congestion with stopped cars in the center and left lanes. That said, the car blindly crossed 3 lanes of traffic and should have proceeded with more caution. That SUV surely obstructed the drivers view and I doubt they would have seen a dump truck coming down that lane.

Video 2, the KIA asshat obviously should not have pulled out like that, stopping in the middle of the lanes. I question if left turns are even permitted there given the angle of the street and the 3 lanes that must be crossed just to get to the center lane. At any rate, the motorcyclist had PLENTY of time to come to a stop or at least change lanes to the right and go around the back of the car. Theres no excuse for that.

IMO, if you're on a bike (or even in a car) you HAVE TO not only watch out for this kind of shit from other motorists but EXPECT IT and take action to avoid it. Whenever I'm on the street I've come to adopt the mindset that there is someone in a car out to kill me and it's up to me to identify them before they can accomplish the task.

I do hope both riders are not seriously injured.
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May 14th 2018, 06:38 PM   #3
 galenernest's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Beijing

  Honda CBF190R
The rider in the second video must be newish... seemed like he made an attempt to slow a bit, but target fixated on the car. He had plenty of time to come to a complete stop or swerve around the car...
May 14th 2018, 07:41 PM   #4
 paradox206's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Des Moines

  M1200S, VFR800, XR650R & GSXR750
Yeah, the first rider was definitely going too fast (which is very common on Elliott) and the second rider locked up his rear based on the 15' skid mark I could see from the pedestrian bridge nearby. It's become such a regular thing that someone on the 4th floor started filming every day. We've even had someone crash into the building!

May 15th 2018, 07:13 AM   #5
 coastrider's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Oregon Coast

  2017 BMW R1200RT
In the first video it appears there are two lanes for traffic and the motorcycle was riding on the shoulder. If you are going to ride on the shoulder cars are not likely to expect that so going slow, especially across an intersection or driveway and using extra caution is needed by a rider - motorcycle or bicycle. Given the speed and what looks to me riding illegally I would assign a good bit of the blame to that rider.

In the second video the auto should not have been blocking both lanes of traffic. When he pulled out that motor cycle looked to be far away. Had the rider seen the van I think could have slowed and either stopped or gone behind it. Given the riders lane placement it likely seemed reasonable to decide to go in front of the auto. There was no other traffic around the motorcycle so I think switching lanes and going behind the auto, if a stop was not possible, would have been better as it is likely that at some point the auto intends to continue moving forward. Of course I have a great overhead view to see just how clear of traffic the area was, the motorcycle has a different view.

This is why I prefer open country roads to traffic, but then I am lucky as all my riding is for fun, not basic transportation.
May 15th 2018, 09:00 AM   #6
 WarpShatner7's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Here

  R1200ST, CB350
Quote:
Originally Posted by coastrider
In the first video it appears there are two lanes for traffic and the motorcycle was riding on the shoulder.
A dashed line is never used to demarcate the shoulder, so i expect it's a lane. Let's look on street view: https://goo.gl/maps/E81GttN6qGt Yeah, lane. I agree the motorcycle should have been a lot more cautious; and he's going too fast for the situation and might be speeding. But it's incumbent on the car in that situation to yield to oncoming traffic, and if he can't see whether anything's coming he legally can't proceed. So unless the motorcycle was speeding the fault is with the driver.

Edited by WarpShatner7 on May 15th 2018 at 09:03 AM Reason: Allow for the fact that the motorcycle might have been speeding
May 15th 2018, 09:33 AM   #7
 jared p's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  here

  there
Isn't that a bus lane during that time though? Hence no other cars were in the lane inexplicably as he sped past stopped traffic?
May 15th 2018, 09:49 AM   #8
DGA
 DGA's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  PDX

  An Ape and a Husky
It's of little consequence who's at fault when you are laying on the concrete broken. Both times there was plenty that the motorcycle rider could have done to safeguard themselves from injury.
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May 15th 2018, 09:58 AM   #9
 paradox206's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Des Moines

  M1200S, VFR800, XR650R & GSXR750
Quote:
Originally Posted by jared p
Isn't that a bus lane during that time though? Hence no other cars were in the lane inexplicably as he sped past stopped traffic?
That's still an everyone lane at this location, but it does change into a bus lane two blocks up (just past Harrison). That lane is usually clear because either people have filtered into lower QA via the previous streets, or they've already merged over early in anticipation of the lane change.
May 15th 2018, 12:43 PM   #10
 Sentinel's Avatar
 
  Jun 2016
  Poor Tortured

  2015 Kawasaki Concours 14 - The Origame Sea-Dragon
man i hate riding in an "open" lane when the lane next to it is full of stopped cars. IIRC a woman (a sailor) was injured last year (or so) walking across a street near the shipyard when she stepped out from in front of a stopped lane of cars into an "empty" lane while a guy was driving down that empty lane and didn't see her stepping right into full speed traffic. i think its 35mph there. same kind of thing as we see here: no sight distance, people driving their cars into blind situations.

last time I skipped riding on a nice saturday my wife asked me why I was staying home on such a sunny day I told her, "I still love motorcycles as much as ever but I don't love the road any more."

Edited by Sentinel on May 15th 2018 at 12:46 PM
May 15th 2018, 01:44 PM   #11
 paradox206's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Des Moines

  M1200S, VFR800, XR650R & GSXR750
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel
man i hate riding in an "open" lane when the lane next to it is full of stopped cars. IIRC a woman (a sailor) was injured last year (or so) walking across a street near the shipyard when she stepped out from in front of a stopped lane of cars into an "empty" lane while a guy was driving down that empty lane and didn't see her stepping right into full speed traffic. i think its 35mph there. same kind of thing as we see here: no sight distance, people driving their cars into blind situations.

last time I skipped riding on a nice saturday my wife asked me why I was staying home on such a sunny day I told her, "I still love motorcycles as much as ever but I don't love the road any more."
I had a similar thing happen just a block south from where these accidents happened. There is a crosswalk with two lanes of traffic heading south bound and often one car will stop for a pedestrian while the car behind them will whip into the other lane and blast on by. Between logic and two of my coworkers getting hit by cars there, I know not to step into the next lane without sticking my head out first to check. Using the picture below, I was going from right to left, the east lane car stopped while a west lane was car swerved, slammed on his brakes when he saw me peeking a look and did a four wheel slide through the cross walk (and about 10' past it). The lady on the other side of the crosswalk told me she thought she was about to watch me die.

The other crosswalks in this area aren't much better (which is one of the reasons why all of the businesses in this area lobbied for the pedestrian bridge). This area is just a death trap.

May 15th 2018, 05:34 PM   #12
 Naza's Avatar
 
  Feb 2016
  Rent'n

  2002 Honda RC51, 2005 Honda RC51
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradox206
I had a similar thing happen just a block south from where these accidents happened. There is a crosswalk with two lanes of traffic heading south bound and often one car will stop for a pedestrian while the car behind them will whip into the other lane and blast on by. Between logic and two of my coworkers getting hit by cars there, I know not to step into the next lane without sticking my head out first to check. Using the picture below, I was going from right to left, the east lane car stopped while a west lane was car swerved, slammed on his brakes when he saw me peeking a look and did a four wheel slide through the cross walk (and about 10' past it). The lady on the other side of the crosswalk told me she thought she was about to watch me die.

The other crosswalks in this area aren't much better (which is one of the reasons why all of the businesses in this area lobbied for the pedestrian bridge). This area is just a death trap.

^^^^^^^
This!!!

This is why I am really for AI driving/autonomous and that I will probably not own a car in the next couple of years. I am not a "we must save lives" person, but this shit is getting lame. Death is fine....living the rest of your life crippled is not.

I am going to bring up late splitting: All the cagers get upset when the motos want to mod the laws.

However, I see this shit aaaaaaaallllllllll the time. I swear I said this before, but on a two lane road by a freakn middle school..a big Suburban in front on me stopped, I in my 1500 Ram, for a ped and this dick behind me cut over and passed both of us on the right and blew by the crosswalk where the ped was walking.

Same with the people passing on School Busses. In an AI car...all laws are programmed in (in theory)
May 15th 2018, 06:21 PM   #13
 Sentinel's Avatar
 
  Jun 2016
  Poor Tortured

  2015 Kawasaki Concours 14 - The Origame Sea-Dragon
yeah that pseudo-AI self-driving stuff is a real problem though. i mean - we are nowhere near getting it right.

i watched Musks "real" AI comments again today. Dude has seen some high end stuff and he warns us to kill it before it grows (basically. he has to be more PC than that).

But that's what he's saying, and I agree.

No human knows where that shit is headed, and yet some self righteous motherfuckers are going to release it on us without our consent.

I call for direct action against the AI robots - now. Fuck waiting until Tetra Vaal hits the streets.



DO NOT LAUGH. If you think that shit isn't coming within 5 years you haven't been paying attention to Boston Dynamics.

You should be scared and angry.

We now return you to your traffic thread in progress...
MotoDan likes this.

Edited by Sentinel on May 15th 2018 at 06:24 PM
May 16th 2018, 06:44 AM   #14
 Texasl's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Northeast Olalla

  07 Guzzi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel
man i hate riding in an "open" lane when the lane next to it is full of stopped cars. IIRC a woman (a sailor) was injured last year (or so) walking across a street near the shipyard when she stepped out from in front of a stopped lane of cars into an "empty" lane while a guy was driving down that empty lane and didn't see her stepping right into full speed traffic. i think its 35mph there. same kind of thing as we see here: no sight distance, people driving their cars into blind situations.

last time I skipped riding on a nice saturday my wife asked me why I was staying home on such a sunny day I told her, "I still love motorcycles as much as ever but I don't love the road any more."
That is why I advise my students to only go 10 MPH faster than the adjacent lane, even if their lane is clear ahead. That shortens their required urgent reaction space to about 2 car lengths, which can be fairly well managed by proper lane positioning and target scanning.
May 16th 2018, 07:43 AM   #15
 Nathan's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  space needle

News flash: All of Seattle is a Death Zone

Ride accordingly...
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