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Jan 24th 2019, 04:59 PM   #1
 Chrishil54's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kirkland

  2009 V-Star 1100 Custom
Wa sb5303

Some of the phrasing in SB5303 bill is worrisome.

"Motorcycle instruction permit. A person holding a valid driver's license who wishes to learn to ride a motorcycle may apply for a motorcycle instruction permit. The department may issue a motorcycle instruction permit after the applicant has successfully passed all *removed current language* knowledge and skills examinations required and approved by the department."

So they can basically say that you need to pass all license requirements to get an instruction permit. You then have to have xx hours of riding with the permit before you can apply for your license.

I may be reading more into it but the way this state operates, I wouldn't be surprised if they are setting the stage for some shenanigans.
Jan 24th 2019, 07:14 PM   #2
 Bald Guy's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kennewick

  KTM SAR Husqvarna Strada, Ural Patrol and a shit load of BN125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrishil54
Some of the phrasing in SB5303 bill is worrisome.

"Motorcycle instruction permit. A person holding a valid driver's license who wishes to learn to ride a motorcycle may apply for a motorcycle instruction permit. The department may issue a motorcycle instruction permit after the applicant has successfully passed all *removed current language* knowledge and skills examinations required and approved by the department."

So they can basically say that you need to pass all license requirements to get an instruction permit. You then have to have xx hours of riding with the permit before you can apply for your license.

I may be reading more into it but the way this state operates, I wouldn't be surprised if they are setting the stage for some shenanigans.
There is a bunch of worrisome crap in there!

This is all being driven by Target Zero.

I am a site sponsor for motorcycle training. They are up to a whole pant load of shit! This legislation is the tip of the iceberg and clears the way for them to make it much more difficult and expensive for a rider to get their endorsement, and will have the added benefit of not doing anything to reduce the number of fatalities! Score!

They also want to make the results of all training classes for two wheels a permit only. They want you to have to come back with your own motorcycle and take an enhanced skills and knowledge test to get your full endorsement.

What a pain in the ass for someone who lives in Lewiston or Omak!

There is more. Much more that they want to do.


While I teach the MSF curriculum, I have not drank to deeply from their Kool Aid. I do believe that training is a good thing and am always looking for a better way. There are no simple solutions to reducing the number of fatalities and still keep our sport affordable (HA!) and accessible. Perhaps DOL/WMSP goal is to reduce fatalities by reducing the number of participants.... Not as many riders, not as many fatalities.

There is so much more they are wanting to do to make it more difficult and expensive to get your endorsement.

Maybe Larry will chime in.
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Jan 25th 2019, 08:35 AM   #3
 Texasl's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Northeast Olalla

  07 Guzzi
I have been involved in discussions with the lobbyist for DOL, and, although I'm not calling it a done deal, we are making progress in cleaning up this mess. Here is the point sheet that I put together for people to refer to when discussing this issue with their reps.

Poke this link.
Jan 28th 2019, 09:44 PM   #4
 Bald Guy's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kennewick

  KTM SAR Husqvarna Strada, Ural Patrol and a shit load of BN125
How did the hearing go Larry?
Jan 30th 2019, 01:11 PM   #5
 
  Dec 2018
  Goldendale WA

  Classic Sportsters, Triumph & BSA
tvw.org You can watch all the testimony on bills through Washington Legislature, check the archived stuff. Monday the 28th for the senate hearing on that bill
Jan 31st 2019, 07:21 AM   #6
 Texasl's Avatar
Moderator
 
  Jan 2016
  Northeast Olalla

  07 Guzzi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bald Guy
How did the hearing go Larry?
The usual suspects stepped up and whined about the horrendous amount of blood pouring from the scuppers because of NHTSA determined inadequate testing and people who have never shown an aptitude for riding self teaching themselves on a learner's permit.

Of course when they were pressed for data they had almost nil.

For the folks who have not been plugged in to this issue (translation: you have a life), one of the reactions when NHTSA audited the program was a concern that people could merely take a written test and then operate unsupervised on our highways without ever showing any aptitude at all. The point is valid, as all other training licenses require that the operator have direct supervision in the cockpit with them, but at agency they are over engineering their "solutions" and making things more difficult than needed.

I know, big surprise.

The language eliminating the $125.00 class cap is a result of trying to figure out how to rework how the subsidies work on the backside. Again, we are looking at trying to do subtle finish carpentry with a 4# drilling hammer. The way we do subsidized training does need to be revisited, eliminating the precursor language that enables it in the first place is not the way to begin.

As silly as it sounds, I am attempting to screw in a modicum of logic.

DOL fully understands that modifying the structure of the Washington Motorcycle Safety Advisory Board (WMSAB) is a total non-starter and failure to back away from that will result in me calling for an all out assault with torches and pitchforks. It is our dollars that pay for the board, and it is our only avenue to communicate with the program. We will not stand for policy wonks and non-motorcycling lobbyists diluting our voices. Although it looks like that language will go away in any compromise that might happen, it would still behoove everyone to contact their representatives and senators and reinforce the message, not only on SB 5303 but also HB 1116. I want the DOL to fully understand that a firestorm is on the horizon if they persist in being obtuse.

In the unlikely even that you don't know who your reps are (a pox on you and your progeny) poke this link.

Finally, I had a productive conversation with the DOL lobbyist Wednesday, but until they actually roll out a proposal I really don't have any more information.
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Feb 1st 2019, 04:45 PM   #7
 Chrishil54's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Kirkland

  2009 V-Star 1100 Custom
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texasl
The usual suspects stepped up and whined about the horrendous amount of blood pouring from the scuppers because of NHTSA determined inadequate testing and people who have never shown an aptitude for riding self teaching themselves on a learner's permit.

Of course when they were pressed for data they had almost nil.

For the folks who have not been plugged in to this issue (translation: you have a life), one of the reactions when NHTSA audited the program was a concern that people could merely take a written test and then operate unsupervised on our highways without ever showing any aptitude at all. The point is valid, as all other training licenses require that the operator have direct supervision in the cockpit with them, but at agency they are over engineering their "solutions" and making things more difficult than needed.

I know, big surprise.

The language eliminating the $125.00 class cap is a result of trying to figure out how to rework how the subsidies work on the backside. Again, we are looking at trying to do subtle finish carpentry with a 4# drilling hammer. The way we do subsidized training does need to be revisited, eliminating the precursor language that enables it in the first place is not the way to begin.

As silly as it sounds, I am attempting to screw in a modicum of logic.

DOL fully understands that modifying the structure of the Washington Motorcycle Safety Advisory Board (WMSAB) is a total non-starter and failure to back away from that will result in me calling for an all out assault with torches and pitchforks. It is our dollars that pay for the board, and it is our only avenue to communicate with the program. We will not stand for policy wonks and non-motorcycling lobbyists diluting our voices. Although it looks like that language will go away in any compromise that might happen, it would still behoove everyone to contact their representatives and senators and reinforce the message, not only on SB 5303 but also HB 1116. I want the DOL to fully understand that a firestorm is on the horizon if they persist in being obtuse.

In the unlikely even that you don't know who your reps are (a pox on you and your progeny) poke this link.

Finally, I had a productive conversation with the DOL lobbyist Wednesday, but until they actually roll out a proposal I really don't have any more information.
Thank you Larry.
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