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Sep 25th 2019, 08:57 AM   #136
 MV Man's Avatar
 
  Sep 2019
  Portlandia

  MV Agusta F3 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oregon Motorcycle
If ten motorcycles are riding staggered, you basically cut the size of the group in half. So that puts the last rider at half the distance to the front as opposed to riding single file which is what your math is based on.

If the group of ten was riding single file at 2 seconds apart, then yes that puts the last rider 20 seconds back. If the same group was riding staggered at 2 seconds apart, that puts rider 9 at 10 seconds from the front.

And then there’s Oregon,.... they teach 4 riders staggered at 2 seconds and then a 4 second gap between the next group.
It sounds like you're assuming that a 2-second following distance is 2 seconds behind the next motorcycle that's on the same side of the lane as you are, but that's dangerous thinking, as it ignores the motorcycle between you two- if he has to move over for ANY reason, it instantly cuts the gaps to LESS than one second in between each of three motorcycles, and a normal human reaction time to something they're not expecting, is almost one second.

Edited by MV Man on Sep 25th 2019 at 09:06 AM
Sep 25th 2019, 09:00 AM   #137
 Parilla125's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  SeaTac

Quote:
Originally Posted by MV Man
Nobody's blaming the victims.
Well, let's take a look at that.
Their choice of bike style picked on. Check.
Their riding ability picked on because of the bike style. Check.
The 'probable' way they ride (pack style, too close) because of bike style picked on. Check.
There are a lot of posts that 'appear' to be going 'at' the riders when it was the 'tool' (driver causing it) that was the cause.
If he had not been on the road, drunk, loosing control of his vehicle, NONE of this would have happened. Period.
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Sep 25th 2019, 09:03 AM   #138
 Oregon Motorcycle's Avatar
 
  Mar 2019
  oregon

I’m not assuming anything. I’m explaining staggered riding. You can lane share legally in Oregon with other two wheeled “vehicles “. When you study for an endorsement, they teach you how to ride staggered and following distance has nothing to do with who’s next to you.
Sep 25th 2019, 09:45 AM   #139
 coastrider's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  Oregon Coast

  2017 BMW R1200RT
Recent posts keep saying "10 motorcycles".
I understood the accident to involve "10 MOTORCYCLISTS".
Were there not some two-up riders?

Without accident investigation details seems like a lot of guessing and opinions as to how people were riding, what gear they had, if gear would have saved them, what training they had. Maybe all those details have been published in some follow up articles that I have not seen.

I do wear good gear and I try to keep a conservative following distance. But not yet experiencing a truck and trailer moving into my lane I won't say I would have had any better outcome than these riders. I'll stick with putting blame on the truck driver.

As that fellow moving from paradise to the rainy northwest says: "When riding staggered, the space within the lane beside each motorcyclist, belongs to that motorcyclist, not the one behind him.". Yes indeed, it is my &#%$@*^ lane, stay out. So follow me at a prudent distance. Don't calculate following distance based on the guy in front of me because at any moment I might just decide I like the other half of MY lane better than where I am and move over. :-)
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Edited by coastrider on Sep 25th 2019 at 09:46 AM Reason: typo
Sep 25th 2019, 11:57 AM   #140
 MV Man's Avatar
 
  Sep 2019
  Portlandia

  MV Agusta F3 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by coastrider
I'll stick with putting blame on the truck driver.

As that fellow moving from paradise to the rainy northwest says: "When riding staggered, the space within the lane beside each motorcyclist, belongs to that motorcyclist, not the one behind him.". Yes indeed, it is my &#%$@*^ lane, stay out. So follow me at a prudent distance. Don't calculate following distance based on the guy in front of me because at any moment I might just decide I like the other half of MY lane better than where I am and move over. :-)
Amen, brother...
Sep 25th 2019, 10:03 PM   #141
 MV Man's Avatar
 
  Sep 2019
  Portlandia

  MV Agusta F3 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parilla125
Well, let's take a look at that.
Their choice of bike style picked on. Check.
Their riding ability picked on because of the bike style. Check.
The 'probable' way they ride (pack style, too close) because of bike style picked on. Check.
Do you have a single molecule of evidence to offer, that contradicts our suspicions?

Quote:
If he had not been on the road, drunk, loosing control of his vehicle, NONE of this would have happened. Period.
So you are hanging all your hopes of survival, on every single motorist you encounter obeying every single law on the books?

I choose to take a more active role in my own survival, by stacking the deck in my favor. I hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. I assume that every motorist on the road is this offender (or worse), unless and until proven otherwise.

I only ride sober, licensed, and insured, wearing FULL safety gear, on an extremely competent motorcycle, using riding skills developed through a focused and very intentional investment of my time, effort, and financial resources, to an objectively quantifiable level of skill sufficient for others to assign the word "expert" to my road racing license.

Maybe that's why I have reached retirement age.
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Edited by MV Man on Sep 25th 2019 at 10:06 PM
Sep 26th 2019, 06:11 AM   #142
 Parilla125's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  SeaTac

Aaaaand now go after the person that points out the 'blaming the victim'. Perfect.
Sep 26th 2019, 07:45 AM   #143
 MV Man's Avatar
 
  Sep 2019
  Portlandia

  MV Agusta F3 800
Oh, stop it. You're not a victim here- the only victims were those 10 motorcyclists.
Sep 26th 2019, 11:10 AM   #144
 Parilla125's Avatar
 
  Jan 2016
  SeaTac

Repeat above.
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